Отправлено: 24.01.20 19:50. Заголовок: аи Витте и Порт-Артур (продолжение)

Проблемы скорости постройки кораблей, финансирование строительства, способности управленцев (эф. менагероф) того времени известны. Как и особенности комплектации и строительства Дальнего, Порт-Артура, Владивостока и т.д.

Допускаем:
1. аи Витте... ;-) (далее по списку).

 Отправлено: 07.11.22 23:28. Заголовок: Хотелось бы напомнит..

Хотелось бы напомнить что у нас в таблице запланировано строительство ДВЕНАДЦАТИ малых крейсеров - 4-х СуперСветлан с котлами Бельвиля и 8 СуперБояринов с котлами Ярроу или Шульца.
Но позже - с 1894 и 1898 годов соотвественно. Все - по 4000 тонн.
Но я уже не помню что я там накреативил. Почему их двенадцать и какое у них должно быть вооружение.
А корветы - это предшественники. Они более мелкие и более тихоходные.

 Отправлено: 07.11.22 23:34. Заголовок: Инженер Сидоров пише..

Инженер Сидоров пишет:

цитата:

, 2 - 135 и 8 - 87 будет вполне логично.

У англичанов были крейсера-скауты которые по спецификации Адмиралтейства: должны были иметь ход - 25 узлов, 10 76-мм, 8 47-мм пушек, два торпедных аппарата.
Sentinel, Adventure, Forward, Pathfinder. Водоизмещение в районе 3000 тонн. Паровые машины в 15-17 тысяч лошадей.
И только на заложенной в 1907 Boadicea - поставили 4-х дюймовые пушки и паровые турбины. Тоже 25 узлов.

 Отправлено: 16.11.22 21:39. Заголовок: аи-РюрикЪ-3а, развит..

аи-РюрикЪ-3а, развитие Шанзи, Память Азова с влиянием Нахимов и Анри IV, три трубы, башни вращаются на 360 градусовЪ.
6 шт: Рюрик, Громобой, Ослябя, Пересвет, Орёл, Слава - laid down 1893, Displacement: 4 144 t light; 4 393 t standard; 4 610 t normal; 4 783 t full load

Скрытый текст

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (338,14 ft / 324,80 ft) x 54,46 ft x (16,40 / 16,90 ft) (103,07 m / 99,00 m) x 16,60 m x (5,00 / 5,15 m) Armament: 8 - 7,87" / 200 mm 35,0 cal guns - 275,58lbs / 125,00kg shells, 110 per gun Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1893 Model 2 x 2-gun mounts on centreline, forward deck forward 2 x 2-gun mounts on centreline, aft deck aft 1 raised mount aft - superfiring 8 - 3,94" / 100,0 mm 45,0 cal guns - 30,77lbs / 13,96kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1893 Model 8 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck aft 8 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in heavy seas 6 - 2,01" / 51,0 mm 45,0 cal guns - 4,08lbs / 1,85kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1893 Model 6 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck aft Weight of broadside 2 475 lbs / 1 123 kg Main Torpedoes 4 - 15,0" / 380 mm, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m torpedoes - 0,296 t each, 1,184 t total In 4 sets of deck mounted side rotating tubes Armour: - Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg) Main: 3,54" / 90 mm 249,34 ft / 76,00 m 7,22 ft / 2,20 m Ends: Unarmoured Main Belt covers 118% of normal length - Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max) Main: 5,91" / 150 mm 3,54" / 90 mm 5,91" / 150 mm 2nd: 1,18" / 30 mm 0,39" / 10 mm - - Protected deck - single deck: For and Aft decks: 0,94" / 24 mm Forecastle: 0,71" / 18 mm Quarter deck: 0,87" / 22 mm - Conning towers: Forward 4,72" / 120 mm, Aft 0,00" / 0 mm Machinery: Coal and oil fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines, Direct drive, 2 shafts, 7 286 ihp / 5 436 Kw = 18,00 kts Range 2 500nm at 10,00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 390 tons (50% coal) Complement: 279 - 363 Cost: £0,462 million / $1,847 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 451 tons, 9,8% - Guns: 449 tons, 9,7% - Weapons: 2 tons, 0,1% Armour: 982 tons, 21,3% - Belts: 269 tons, 5,8% - Armament: 471 tons, 10,2% - Armour Deck: 213 tons, 4,6% - Conning Tower: 28 tons, 0,6% Machinery: 1 213 tons, 26,3% Hull, fittings & equipment: 1 497 tons, 32,5% Fuel, ammunition & stores: 466 tons, 10,1% Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0,0% Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 3 401 lbs / 1 543 Kg = 13,9 x 7,9 " / 200 mm shells or 4,0 torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,21 Metacentric height 2,8 ft / 0,9 m Roll period: 13,6 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 83 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,98 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,65 Hull form characteristics: Hull has rise forward of midbreak, a normal bow and a round stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,556 / 0,560 Length to Beam Ratio: 5,96 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 18,02 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 50 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 19,00 degrees Stern overhang: 6,56 ft / 2,00 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 17,00%, 19,69 ft / 6,00 m, 16,40 ft / 5,00 m - Forward deck: 48,00%, 16,40 ft / 5,00 m, 16,40 ft / 5,00 m - Aft deck: 21,00%, 11,48 ft / 3,50 m, 11,48 ft / 3,50 m - Quarter deck: 14,00%, 11,48 ft / 3,50 m, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m - Average freeboard: 15,02 ft / 4,58 m Ship tends to be wet forward Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 115,6% - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 124,5% Waterplane Area: 12 415 Square feet or 1 153 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 96% Structure weight / hull surface area: 97 lbs/sq ft or 472 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 0,75 - Longitudinal: 2,23 - Overall: 0,84 Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space Excellent accommodation and workspace room Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

аи-Наварин-2с: 400-мм /фактически 35, 1 выстрел в минуту. 2 трубы (м.б. у нью-Наварина оставить "табуретку"?), 9 шт - Наварин, Сисой, Севастополь, Полтава, Петропавловск, Победа, Гангут, Выборг, Андрей Первозванный: laid down 1896, Displacement: 9 096 t light; 10 279 t standard; 10 724 t normal; 11 080 t full load +3 с 12" для ЧФ (Евстафий, Златоуст, Пантелеймон).

Скрытый текст

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (410,32 ft / 396,98 ft) x 78,74 ft x (19,69 / 20,27 ft) (125,07 m / 121,00 m) x 24,00 m x (6,00 / 6,18 m) Armament: 6 - 15,75" / 400 mm 33,0 cal guns - 1 873,93lbs / 850,00kg shells, 150 per gun Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1896 Model 3 x 2-gun mounts on centreline ends, majority forward 12 - 3,94" / 100,0 mm 40,0 cal guns - 29,24lbs / 13,26kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1896 Model 12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread 12 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in all but light seas 8 - 1,97" / 50,0 mm 45,0 cal guns - 3,85lbs / 1,74kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1896 Model 6 x Single mounts on sides, aft deck forward 2 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck aft Weight of broadside 11 625 lbs / 5 273 kg Main Torpedoes 2 - 15,0" / 380 mm, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m torpedoes - 0,332 t each, 0,664 t total In 2 sets of deck mounted side rotating tubes Armour: - Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg) Main: 11,0" / 280 mm 295,28 ft / 90,00 m 7,87 ft / 2,40 m Ends: 1,18" / 30 mm 68,90 ft / 21,00 m 9,84 ft / 3,00 m 32,81 ft / 10,00 m Unarmoured ends Main Belt covers 114% of normal length - Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max) Main: 11,0" / 280 mm 4,72" / 120 mm 11,0" / 280 mm 2nd: 1,18" / 30 mm 0,39" / 10 mm - - Protected deck - single deck: For and Aft decks: 1,26" / 32 mm Forecastle: 0,71" / 18 mm Quarter deck: 0,94" / 24 mm - Conning towers: Forward 7,87" / 200 mm, Aft 0,00" / 0 mm Machinery: Coal and oil fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines, Direct drive, 2 shafts, 7 693 ihp / 5 739 Kw = 16,00 kts Range 3 000nm at 10,00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 801 tons (66% coal) Complement: 526 - 684 Cost: £1,254 million / $5,017 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 1 655 tons, 15,4% - Guns: 1 654 tons, 15,4% - Weapons: 1 tons, 0,0% Armour: 3 058 tons, 28,5% - Belts: 1 155 tons, 10,8% - Armament: 1 313 tons, 12,2% - Armour Deck: 508 tons, 4,7% - Conning Tower: 82 tons, 0,8% Machinery: 1 240 tons, 11,6% Hull, fittings & equipment: 3 142 tons, 29,3% Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1 628 tons, 15,2% Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0,0% Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 6 955 lbs / 3 155 Kg = 3,6 x 15,7 " / 400 mm shells or 6,2 torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,33 Metacentric height 5,8 ft / 1,8 m Roll period: 13,7 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 76 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,89 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,53 Hull form characteristics: Hull has a flush deck, a normal bow and a cruiser stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,610 / 0,612 Length to Beam Ratio: 5,04 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 19,92 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 42 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 19,00 degrees Stern overhang: 6,56 ft / 2,00 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 20,00%, 19,69 ft / 6,00 m, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m - Forward deck: 30,00%, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m - Aft deck: 35,00%, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m - Quarter deck: 15,00%, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m, 16,40 ft / 5,00 m - Average freeboard: 15,28 ft / 4,66 m Ship tends to be wet forward Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 106,3% - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 122,4% Waterplane Area: 23 076 Square feet or 2 144 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 84% Structure weight / hull surface area: 129 lbs/sq ft or 630 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 0,60 - Longitudinal: 1,61 - Overall: 0,67 Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space Excellent accommodation and workspace room Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

аи-Паллада-2е: 8 шт - Паллада, Диана, Аврора, Юнона, Светлана, Ксения, Ольга, Мария. + 3 для ЧФ (Вера, Надежда, Любовь).
+ Амур, Енисей, Анадырь - как МЗ и Штандарт, Полярная Звезда, София - как учебные крейсера-яхты: без 8" и с ходом 23-24 уз -
laid down 1898, Displacement: 2 178 t light; 2 291 t standard; 2 406 t normal; 2 497 t full load

Скрытый текст

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (345,59 ft / 331,36 ft) x 42,65 ft x (13,12 / 13,48 ft) (105,33 m / 101,00 m) x 13,00 m x (4,00 / 4,11 m) Armament: 2 - 7,87" / 200 mm 35,0 cal guns - 275,58lbs / 125,00kg shells, 150 per gun Breech loading guns in deck mounts, 1898 Model 2 x Single mounts on centreline, aft deck aft 8 - 3,94" / 100,0 mm 40,0 cal guns - 29,24lbs / 13,26kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1898 Model 8 x Single mounts on sides, forward evenly spread Weight of broadside 785 lbs / 356 kg Main Torpedoes 8 - 15,0" / 380 mm, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m torpedoes - 0,358 t each, 2,863 t total In 4 sets of deck mounted side rotating tubes Armour: - Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg) Main: 1,97" / 50 mm 216,54 ft / 66,00 m 6,56 ft / 2,00 m Ends: Unarmoured Main Belt covers 101% of normal length Main belt does not fully cover magazines and engineering spaces - Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max) Main: 0,79" / 20 mm 0,39" / 10 mm - - Protected deck - single deck: For and Aft decks: 0,94" / 24 mm Forecastle: 0,71" / 18 mm Quarter deck: 0,87" / 22 mm Machinery: Coal and oil fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines, Direct drive, 2 shafts, 6 833 ihp / 5 097 Kw = 20,00 kts Range 2 000nm at 10,00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 206 tons (66% coal) Complement: 171 - 223 Cost: £0,244 million / $0,978 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 95 tons, 3,9% - Guns: 89 tons, 3,7% - Weapons: 6 tons, 0,2% Armour: 281 tons, 11,7% - Belts: 117 tons, 4,9% - Armament: 8 tons, 0,3% - Armour Deck: 155 tons, 6,4% Machinery: 1 010 tons, 42,0% Hull, fittings & equipment: 798 tons, 33,2% Fuel, ammunition & stores: 228 tons, 9,5% Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0,0% Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 1 597 lbs / 725 Kg = 6,5 x 7,9 " / 200 mm shells or 1,9 torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,57 Metacentric height 3,0 ft / 0,9 m Roll period: 10,4 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 97 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,29 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,94 Hull form characteristics: Hull has a flush deck, a normal bow and a round stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,454 / 0,459 Length to Beam Ratio: 7,77 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 18,20 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 47 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 23,00 degrees Stern overhang: 6,56 ft / 2,00 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 19,00%, 18,04 ft / 5,50 m, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m - Forward deck: 40,00%, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m - Aft deck: 27,00%, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m - Quarter deck: 14,00%, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m - Average freeboard: 13,50 ft / 4,11 m Ship tends to be wet forward Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 148,1% - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 129,3% Waterplane Area: 9 045 Square feet or 840 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 90% Structure weight / hull surface area: 60 lbs/sq ft or 294 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 0,89 - Longitudinal: 1,87 - Overall: 0,96 Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space Excellent accommodation and workspace room Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

аи-Новик-е4: 9+6 (чф) шт: Новик, Охотник, Казак, Алмаз, Изумруд, Жемчуг, Джигит, Всадник, Забияка - laid down 1900, Displacement: 1 359 t light; 1 398 t standard; 1 450 t normal; 1 492 t full load

Скрытый текст

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (335,05 ft / 324,80 ft) x 32,81 ft x (10,83 / 11,04 ft) (102,12 m / 99,00 m) x 10,00 m x (3,30 / 3,37 m) Armament: 4 - 3,94" / 100,0 mm 40,0 cal guns - 29,24lbs / 13,26kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1900 Model 2 x Single mounts on centreline, forward evenly spread 2 x Single mounts on centreline, aft evenly spread 2 - 0,98" / 25,0 mm 45,0 cal guns - 0,48lbs / 0,22kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1900 Model 2 x Single mounts on sides, aft deck forward Weight of broadside 118 lbs / 53 kg Main Torpedoes 6 - 17,7" / 450 mm, 16,40 ft / 5,00 m torpedoes - 0,579 t each, 3,477 t total In 3 sets of deck mounted centre rotating tubes Armour: - Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg) Main: 0,47" / 12 mm 144,36 ft / 44,00 m 6,56 ft / 2,00 m Ends: Unarmoured Main Belt covers 68% of normal length Main belt does not fully cover magazines and engineering spaces - Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max) Main: 0,24" / 6 mm - - - Armoured deck - multiple decks: For and Aft decks: 0,47" / 12 mm Forecastle: 0,35" / 9 mm Quarter deck: 0,35" / 9 mm - Conning towers: Forward 0,47" / 12 mm, Aft 0,00" / 0 mm Machinery: Coal and oil fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines, Direct drive, 2 shafts, 9 976 ihp / 7 442 Kw = 24,00 kts Range 1 200nm at 10,00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 94 tons (66% coal) Complement: 116 - 152 Cost: £0,175 million / $0,698 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 26 tons, 1,8% - Guns: 19 tons, 1,3% - Weapons: 7 tons, 0,5% Armour: 80 tons, 5,5% - Belts: 20 tons, 1,4% - Armament: 2 tons, 0,2% - Armour Deck: 57 tons, 3,9% - Conning Tower: 1 tons, 0,1% Machinery: 870 tons, 60,0% Hull, fittings & equipment: 383 tons, 26,4% Fuel, ammunition & stores: 91 tons, 6,3% Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0,0% Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 436 lbs / 198 Kg = 14,3 x 3,9 " / 100 mm shells or 0,6 torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,72 Metacentric height 2,3 ft / 0,7 m Roll period: 9,1 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 61 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,06 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,23 Hull form characteristics: Hull has rise forward of midbreak, a normal bow and a cruiser stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,440 / 0,444 Length to Beam Ratio: 9,90 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 18,02 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 53 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 23,00 degrees Stern overhang: 3,28 ft / 1,00 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 18,00%, 16,40 ft / 5,00 m, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m - Forward deck: 26,00%, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m - Aft deck: 42,00%, 7,22 ft / 2,20 m, 7,22 ft / 2,20 m - Quarter deck: 14,00%, 7,22 ft / 2,20 m, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m - Average freeboard: 10,24 ft / 3,12 m Ship tends to be wet forward Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 197,2% - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 79,2% Waterplane Area: 6 743 Square feet or 626 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 46% Structure weight / hull surface area: 37 lbs/sq ft or 180 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 0,77 - Longitudinal: 0,97 - Overall: 0,79 Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space Cramped accommodation and workspace room Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

+ 18 400т ЭМ,18 200т МН, 24 120т МН, 18 ТЩ, 12 ПЛ, 12 КЛ, 12 ТР.

 Отправлено: 17.11.22 16:53. Заголовок: Мне вот подумалось -..

Мне вот подумалось - а не сделать ли к Альтетнативе 1888 года приквел - Альтернативу 1881 года.
Сделать круче чем Шестаков мы врядли сможем, но будем брать размерами.
Зато цилиндрических котлов и парсов на стальных мачтах будет по полной программе

 Отправлено: 17.11.22 18:12. Заголовок: Пан директор пишет: ..

Пан директор пишет:

цитата:

вот подумалось - а не сделать ли к Альтернативе 1888 года приквел - Альтернативу 1881 года. Сделать круче чем Шестаков мы вряд-ли сможем, но будем брать размерами.

... А что сделалЪ тов. Шестаков?
1881 - да, как раз парусов будет достаточно. Ув. Дампир в 1883 г неплохо сразился.
Какие страны можно альтернативить (в 15% от мощностей, размеров и финаанссов -!?)?
Откройте тему.

 Отправлено: 17.11.22 20:01. Заголовок: Начальный вариант пр..

Начальный вариант проекта аи-Рюрик-мини с 3х2 200-мм, идея "единообразие вида": laid down 1893, Displacement: 4 010 t light; 4 239 t standard; 4 443 t normal; 4 606 t full load

Скрытый текст

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (337,01 ft / 324,80 ft) x 52,49 ft x (16,40 / 16,88 ft) (102,72 m / 99,00 m) x 16,00 m x (5,00 / 5,15 m) Armament: 6 - 7,87" / 200 mm 35,0 cal guns - 297,62lbs / 135,00kg shells, 110 per gun Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1893 Model 2 x 2-gun mounts on centreline, forward deck forward 1 x 2-gun mount on centreline, aft deck aft 12 - 3,94" / 100,0 mm 40,0 cal guns - 29,24lbs / 13,26kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1893 Model 12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread 12 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in all but light seas 8 - 1,97" / 50,0 mm 40,0 cal guns - 3,66lbs / 1,66kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1893 Model 8 x Single mounts on sides, aft deck forward Weight of broadside 2 166 lbs / 982 kg Main Torpedoes 4 - 17,7" / 450 mm, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m torpedoes - 0,410 t each, 1,642 t total In 2 sets of deck mounted side rotating tubes Armour: - Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg) Main: 3,54" / 90 mm 246,06 ft / 75,00 m 7,22 ft / 2,20 m Ends: Unarmoured Main Belt covers 117% of normal length - Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max) Main: 6,30" / 160 mm 3,15" / 80 mm 6,69" / 170 mm 2nd: 1,18" / 30 mm 0,39" / 10 mm - - Protected deck - single deck: For and Aft decks: 0,94" / 24 mm Forecastle: 0,71" / 18 mm Quarter deck: 0,94" / 24 mm - Conning towers: Forward 3,94" / 100 mm, Aft 0,00" / 0 mm Machinery: Coal and oil fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines, Direct drive, 2 shafts, 7 087 ihp / 5 287 Kw = 18,00 kts Range 2 000nm at 10,00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 367 tons (100% coal) Complement: 271 - 353 Cost: £0,431 million / $1,725 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 365 tons, 8,2% - Guns: 361 tons, 8,1% - Weapons: 3 tons, 0,1% Armour: 840 tons, 18,9% - Belts: 265 tons, 6,0% - Armament: 345 tons, 7,8% - Armour Deck: 207 tons, 4,6% - Conning Tower: 23 tons, 0,5% Machinery: 1 243 tons, 28,0% Hull, fittings & equipment: 1 562 tons, 35,2% Fuel, ammunition & stores: 433 tons, 9,8% Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0,0% Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 3 852 lbs / 1 747 Kg = 15,8 x 7,9 " / 200 mm shells or 2,9 torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,36 Metacentric height 3,3 ft / 1,0 m Roll period: 12,2 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 78 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,62 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,57 Hull form characteristics: Hull has a flush deck, a normal bow and a round stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,556 / 0,560 Length to Beam Ratio: 6,19 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 18,02 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 49 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 19,00 degrees Stern overhang: 6,56 ft / 2,00 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 19,00%, 16,40 ft / 5,00 m, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m - Forward deck: 30,00%, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m - Aft deck: 37,00%, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m - Quarter deck: 14,00%, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m - Average freeboard: 13,37 ft / 4,08 m Ship tends to be wet forward Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 116,1% - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 108,5% Waterplane Area: 11 966 Square feet or 1 112 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 100% Structure weight / hull surface area: 102 lbs/sq ft or 498 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 0,91 - Longitudinal: 2,22 - Overall: 1,00 Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space Adequate accommodation and workspace room Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

 Отправлено: 15.01.23 23:38. Заголовок: Полная коллекция 11 ..

Полная коллекция 11 дюймовых броненосцев из этой альтернативы.
Два 12 тысячных и один 14 тысячный.
Самый здоровый - это фрагманский корабль, с увеличенным водоизмещением, 16 5,25-мм пушками половина из которых в башнях, и дополнительными помещениями для флагмана и штаба.
14000 тонн не влез. Там даже 13 500 сильно натянуто.
При этом для 12000 - 12 тысяч тонн маловато. Хорошо бы накинуть ещё тонн 500-700.
А так корабли совершенно стандартные.

 Отправлено: 03.02.23 11:16. Заголовок: Яхты... как крейсера..

Яхты... как крейсера:
После сокрушительного провала яхты "Ливадия", царь-ампираторЪ Александр III изменил отношение к флоту. Увеличилось количество металлургических и машиностроительных (в т.ч. паровозостроительных, судостроительных и сельскохозяйственных) заводов. Отказ от Либавы как военной базы.
В постройке - однотипные "Александр 2", "Николай 1" и "Гангут"-аи. "Наварин", "Сисой Великий" и аи-"Иоанн Грозный" (на пожертвования народные и купеческие, название обсуждаемо) - как Наварин с высоким бортом и с 2х2 12"/35 в башнях, 8 152/45 в казематах.

И яхты - с возможностью переделки в крейсера, малые - 2000-3000 т, 19-23 уз (+4-6 120-152 мм и палубой в 32-мм) и большие - 4000-5000 т, 19-21 уз, 6 75-мм и 8 47-мм в мирное время, после перестройки лёгких верхних салонов, рубок и мачт - 12-16 152-мм, 12-16 47-мм, 2 та. Борт (мко) и палуба -25 мм.

Силуэты "классические": 2 трубы, 3 мачты, клиперский форштевень.

малые: Александра, Мария, Ксения, Ольга, Анастасия, Веста.

большие : Балтика - Штандарт, Средиземноморье - Полярная Звезда, Тихий океан - Россия.
laid down 1892, Displacement: 4 051 t light; 4 290 t standard; 4 544 t normal; 4 748 t full load

Скрытый текст

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (417,13 ft / 400,26 ft) x 45,93 ft x (14,76 / 15,30 ft) (127,14 m / 122,00 m) x 14,00 m x (4,50 / 4,66 m) Armament: 12 - 5,98" / 152 mm 45,0 cal guns - 108,07lbs / 49,02kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1892 Model 8 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck aft 4 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in all but light seas 4 x Single mounts on sides, aft deck forward 2 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in all but light seas 4 - 5,98" / 152 mm 45,0 cal guns - 108,07lbs / 49,02kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1892 Model 2 x Single mounts on centreline, forward deck forward 1 raised mount - superfiring 2 x Single mounts on centreline, aft deck aft 1 raised mount - superfiring 16 - 1,85" / 47,0 mm 35,0 cal guns - 2,97lbs / 1,35kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in deck mount, 1892 Model 1 x Single mount on sides amidships Weight of broadside 1 777 lbs / 806 kg Main Torpedoes 2 - 15,0" / 380 mm, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m torpedoes - 0,254 t each, 0,508 t total In 2 sets of deck mounted side rotating tubes Armour: - Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg) Main: 1,46" / 37 mm 288,71 ft / 88,00 m 8,20 ft / 2,50 m Ends: Unarmoured Main Belt covers 111% of normal length Main belt does not fully cover magazines and engineering spaces - Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max) Main: 0,59" / 15 mm 0,28" / 7 mm - 2nd: 0,59" / 15 mm 0,28" / 7 mm - - Armoured deck - multiple decks: For and Aft decks: 0,98" / 25 mm Forecastle: 0,71" / 18 mm Quarter deck: 0,98" / 25 mm - Conning towers: Forward 2,01" / 51 mm, Aft 0,00" / 0 mm Machinery: Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines, Direct drive, 2 shafts, 11 939 ihp / 8 906 Kw = 21,00 kts Range 1 600nm at 12,00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 458 tons (100% coal) Complement: 276 - 359 Cost: £0,519 million / $2,076 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 304 tons, 6,7% - Guns: 303 tons, 6,7% - Weapons: 1 tons, 0,0% Armour: 421 tons, 9,3% - Belts: 142 tons, 3,1% - Armament: 29 tons, 0,6% - Armour Deck: 238 tons, 5,2% - Conning Tower: 12 tons, 0,3% Machinery: 2 096 tons, 46,1% Hull, fittings & equipment: 1 230 tons, 27,1% Fuel, ammunition & stores: 494 tons, 10,9% Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0,0% Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 2 039 lbs / 925 Kg = 19,0 x 6,0 " / 152 mm shells or 2,7 torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,57 Metacentric height 3,3 ft / 1,0 m Roll period: 10,6 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 90 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,40 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 2,00 Hull form characteristics: Hull has raised forecastle, a normal bow and a round stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,586 / 0,591 Length to Beam Ratio: 8,71 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 20,01 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 48 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 45 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 17,00 degrees Stern overhang: 9,84 ft / 3,00 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 20,00%, 22,97 ft / 7,00 m, 18,04 ft / 5,50 m - Forward deck: 30,00%, 16,40 ft / 5,00 m, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m - Aft deck: 35,00%, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m - Quarter deck: 15,00%, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m, 16,40 ft / 5,00 m - Average freeboard: 16,18 ft / 4,93 m Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 167,7% - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 137,2% Waterplane Area: 13 271 Square feet or 1 233 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 83% Structure weight / hull surface area: 67 lbs/sq ft or 328 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 0,84 - Longitudinal: 1,51 - Overall: 0,89 Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space Excellent accommodation and workspace room Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

 Отправлено: 03.02.23 16:36. Заголовок: аи-"малая" я..

аи-"малая" яхта - возможна закладка в более ранние годы: по паре в 1887, в 1890 и в 1893... Уточнения, при необходимости, на все классы - позднее.
Расчёт шарпия на максимально вооружённый вариант. Малые яхты можно для опытов, как на кошках.

laid down 1897, Displacement: 2 373 t light; 2 463 t standard; 2 594 t normal; 2 698 t full load

Скрытый текст

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (363,26 ft / 351,05 ft) x 45,93 ft x (9,84 / 10,16 ft) (110,72 m / 107,00 m) x 14,00 m x (3,00 / 3,10 m) Armament: 6 - 4,72" / 120 mm 45,0 cal guns - 53,17lbs / 24,12kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1897 Model 4 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck aft 2 x Single mounts on sides, aft deck forward 2 - 4,72" / 120 mm 45,0 cal guns - 53,17lbs / 24,12kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1897 Model 1 x Single mount on centreline, forward deck forward 1 x Single mount on centreline, aft deck aft 12 - 1,85" / 47,0 mm 35,0 cal guns - 2,97lbs / 1,35kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1897 Model 12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread Weight of broadside 461 lbs / 209 kg Main Torpedoes 2 - 15,0" / 380 mm, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m torpedoes - 0,309 t each, 0,619 t total In 2 sets of deck mounted side rotating tubes Armour: - Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max) Main: 0,59" / 15 mm 0,28" / 7 mm - 2nd: 0,59" / 15 mm 0,28" / 7 mm - - Protected deck - single deck: For and Aft decks: 1,46" / 37 mm Forecastle: 0,47" / 12 mm Quarter deck: 0,71" / 18 mm - Conning towers: Forward 2,01" / 51 mm, Aft 0,00" / 0 mm Machinery: Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines, Direct drive, 2 shafts, 9 140 ihp / 6 818 Kw = 21,00 kts Range 1 200nm at 12,00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 236 tons (100% coal) Complement: 181 - 236 Cost: £0,286 million / $1,145 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 82 tons, 3,2% - Guns: 81 tons, 3,1% - Weapons: 1 tons, 0,0% Armour: 305 tons, 11,8% - Armament: 17 tons, 0,6% - Armour Deck: 281 tons, 10,8% - Conning Tower: 8 tons, 0,3% Machinery: 1 295 tons, 49,9% Hull, fittings & equipment: 690 tons, 26,6% Fuel, ammunition & stores: 221 tons, 8,5% Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0,0% Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 1 174 lbs / 532 Kg = 22,3 x 4,7 " / 120 mm shells or 1,9 torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,96 Metacentric height 4,6 ft / 1,4 m Roll period: 9,0 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 62 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,06 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,23 Hull form characteristics: Hull has raised forecastle, raised quarterdeck , a normal bow and a round stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,572 / 0,576 Length to Beam Ratio: 7,64 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 18,74 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 50 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 19,00 degrees Stern overhang: 6,56 ft / 2,00 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 18,00%, 16,40 ft / 5,00 m, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m - Forward deck: 30,00%, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m - Aft deck: 37,00%, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m - Quarter deck: 15,00%, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m - Average freeboard: 11,16 ft / 3,40 m Ship tends to be wet forward Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 169,9% - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 117,5% Waterplane Area: 11 488 Square feet or 1 067 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 74% Structure weight / hull surface area: 48 lbs/sq ft or 237 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 0,83 - Longitudinal: 0,83 - Overall: 0,83 Caution: Hull subject to strain in open-sea Cramped machinery, storage, compartmentation space Adequate accommodation and workspace room Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

минный крейсер (возможно 8х2 бортовых та) + подтипы: быстроходной КЛ (2-4 152); посыльны корабль\аиСКР, МЗ
laid down 1896, Displacement: 912 t light; 945 t standard; 999 t normal; 1 043 t full load

Скрытый текст

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (267,48 ft / 255,91 ft) x 26,25 ft x (9,84 / 10,17 ft) (81,53 m / 78,00 m) x 8,00 m x (3,00 / 3,10 m) Armament: 2 - 4,72" / 120 mm 45,0 cal guns - 53,17lbs / 24,12kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1896 Model 2 x Single mounts on centreline, aft evenly spread 4 - 2,95" / 75,0 mm 45,0 cal guns - 12,98lbs / 5,89kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1896 Model 4 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck forward Weight of broadside 158 lbs / 72 kg Main Torpedoes 8 - 15,0" / 380 mm, 13,12 ft / 4,00 m torpedoes - 0,298 t each, 2,380 t total In 8 sets of deck mounted side rotating tubes Armour: - Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max) Main: 0,28" / 7 mm - - 2nd: 0,20" / 5 mm - - - Conning towers: Forward 0,47" / 12 mm, Aft 0,00" / 0 mm Machinery: Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines, Direct drive, 2 shafts, 9 221 ihp / 6 879 Kw = 24,00 kts Range 900nm at 12,00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 98 tons (100% coal) Caution: Delicate, lightweight machinery Complement: 88 - 115 Cost: £0,125 million / $0,502 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 33 tons, 3,3% - Guns: 28 tons, 2,8% - Weapons: 5 tons, 0,5% Armour: 4 tons, 0,4% - Armament: 3 tons, 0,3% - Conning Tower: 1 tons, 0,1% Machinery: 613 tons, 61,4% Hull, fittings & equipment: 261 tons, 26,2% Fuel, ammunition & stores: 87 tons, 8,8% Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0,0% Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 271 lbs / 123 Kg = 5,1 x 4,7 " / 120 mm shells or 0,8 torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,64 Metacentric height 1,5 ft / 0,5 m Roll period: 8,9 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 52 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,17 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,14 Hull form characteristics: Hull has raised forecastle, a normal bow and a round stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,529 / 0,534 Length to Beam Ratio: 9,75 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 16,00 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 63 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 46 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 17,00 degrees Stern overhang: 6,56 ft / 2,00 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 20,00%, 16,40 ft / 5,00 m, 11,48 ft / 3,50 m - Forward deck: 30,00%, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m - Aft deck: 35,00%, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m - Quarter deck: 15,00%, 9,84 ft / 3,00 m, 11,48 ft / 3,50 m - Average freeboard: 10,69 ft / 3,26 m Ship tends to be wet forward Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 205,6% - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 94,8% Waterplane Area: 4 596 Square feet or 427 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 32% Structure weight / hull surface area: 33 lbs/sq ft or 161 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 0,71 - Longitudinal: 1,80 - Overall: 0,78 Extremely poor machinery, storage, compartmentation space Adequate accommodation and workspace room

Императорская яхтенная эскадра (группа управления и обеспечения), на театре:
1 большая и 2 малых "яхты", 1 МинКР, 1 КЛ, 1 посыл. судно, 1 КР (прикрытие ТР, из старых т. Азия), 2-6 ТР.

И версия аи-"Петропавловска" с 8" СК в 16 стволов при 2х2 305, 17 уз, 11500 т.
laid down 1894, Displacement: 10 026 t light; 10 722 t standard; 11 201 t normal; 11 585 t full load

Скрытый текст

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (383,86 ft / 367,45 ft) x 68,90 ft x (26,25 / 26,98 ft) (117,00 m / 112,00 m) x 21,00 m x (8,00 / 8,22 m) Armament: 4 - 12,01" / 305 mm 40,0 cal guns - 829,70lbs / 376,34kg shells, 80 per gun Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1894 Model 1 x 2-gun mount on centreline, forward deck forward 1 x 2-gun mount on centreline, aft deck aft 8 - 7,99" / 203 mm 35,0 cal guns - 239,33lbs / 108,56kg shells, 150 per gun Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1894 Model 2 x 2-gun mounts on sides, forward deck aft 2 x 2-gun mounts on sides, aft deck forward 8 - 7,99" / 203 mm 35,0 cal guns - 239,33lbs / 108,56kg shells, 150 per gun Breech loading guns in casemate mounts, 1894 Model 4 x Single mounts on sides, forward evenly spread 4 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in all but light seas 4 x Single mounts on sides, aft evenly spread 4 hull mounts in casemates- Limited use in all but light seas 20 - 1,85" / 47,0 mm 35,0 cal guns - 2,97lbs / 1,35kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1894 Model 20 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread 8 raised mounts Weight of broadside 7 207 lbs / 3 269 kg Armour: - Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg) Main: 14,0" / 356 mm 216,54 ft / 66,00 m 8,20 ft / 2,50 m Ends: 5,98" / 152 mm 177,17 ft / 54,00 m 9,84 ft / 3,00 m Upper: 4,02" / 102 mm 216,54 ft / 66,00 m 6,56 ft / 2,00 m Main Belt covers 91% of normal length - Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max) Main: 12,0" / 305 mm 7,01" / 178 mm 12,0" / 305 mm 2nd: 7,99" / 203 mm 4,02" / 102 mm 7,01" / 178 mm 3rd: 2,52" / 64 mm 0,71" / 18 mm - - Armoured deck - multiple decks: For and Aft decks: 1,18" / 30 mm Forecastle: 0,87" / 22 mm Quarter deck: 1,02" / 26 mm - Conning towers: Forward 10,00" / 254 mm, Aft 0,00" / 0 mm Machinery: Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines, Direct drive, 2 shafts, 9 818 ihp / 7 324 Kw = 17,00 kts Range 1 800nm at 12,00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 863 tons (100% coal) Complement: 543 - 707 Cost: £1,075 million / $4,302 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 1 289 tons, 11,5% - Guns: 1 289 tons, 11,5% Armour: 3 571 tons, 31,9% - Belts: 1 800 tons, 16,1% - Armament: 1 274 tons, 11,4% - Armour Deck: 389 tons, 3,5% - Conning Tower: 108 tons, 1,0% Machinery: 1 693 tons, 15,1% Hull, fittings & equipment: 3 474 tons, 31,0% Fuel, ammunition & stores: 1 175 tons, 10,5% Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0,0% Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 11 434 lbs / 5 186 Kg = 13,2 x 12,0 " / 305 mm shells or 1,8 torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,18 Metacentric height 3,9 ft / 1,2 m Roll period: 14,6 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 77 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,86 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,53 Hull form characteristics: Hull has a flush deck, a ram bow and a cruiser stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,590 / 0,594 Length to Beam Ratio: 5,33 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 19,17 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 47 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 5,00 degrees Stern overhang: 6,56 ft / 2,00 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 20,00%, 19,69 ft / 6,00 m, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m - Forward deck: 30,00%, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m - Aft deck: 35,00%, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m - Quarter deck: 15,00%, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m, 16,40 ft / 5,00 m - Average freeboard: 15,28 ft / 4,66 m Ship tends to be wet forward Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 90,1% - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 95,0% Waterplane Area: 18 344 Square feet or 1 704 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 97% Structure weight / hull surface area: 154 lbs/sq ft or 751 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 0,90 - Longitudinal: 2,88 - Overall: 1,02 Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space Adequate accommodation and workspace room Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform Excellent seaboat, comfortable, can fire her guns in the heaviest weather

 Отправлено: 04.02.23 18:50. Заголовок: аи -проекты: лидер-с..

аи -проекты:
лидер-скаут (3 р) лг кр -1800-2000 т,24 уз, 4х1 120 по схеме "Дюпре" -8+2,
лг бркр (2 р) - 4000 т, 22-24 уз, 4х2 152 (сх Дюпре), 90-мм пояс -6+2,
Бркр (1р) - 6000 т, 20-21 уз, 4х2 203/4х1 254, 8 120-152, 90-120 мм пояс -4+2,
Эск.Кр-рейдер - 9000 т, 19-20 уз, 2х2 305, 8 120, пояс -120 мм (в почти тождественном корпусе и с машинами для эбр ) -2+2,

аи-ЭБР "РетвизанЪ", развитие некоего аиАвтократорЪ1884: laid down 1897, Displacement: 9 002 t light; 9 532 t standard; 9 884 t normal; 10 165 t full load - 6-9 ед, кроме ЧФ (3 с усилен. 8")

Скрытый текст

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (392,06 ft / 370,73 ft) x 68,90 ft x (19,69 / 20,20 ft) (119,50 m / 113,00 m) x 21,00 m x (6,00 / 6,16 m) Armament: 6 - 12,01" / 305 mm 40,0 cal guns - 829,70lbs / 376,34kg shells, 100 per gun Breech loading guns in turret on barbette mounts, 1897 Model 2 x 2-gun mounts on centreline, forward deck forward 1 x 2-gun mount on centreline, aft deck aft 12 - 4,72" / 120 mm 45,0 cal guns - 53,17lbs / 24,12kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in casemate mounts, 1897 Model 12 x Single mounts on sides, evenly spread 8 - 1,85" / 47,0 mm 35,0 cal guns - 2,97lbs / 1,35kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1897 Model 4 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck aft 4 x Single mounts on sides, aft deck forward Weight of broadside 5 640 lbs / 2 558 kg Armour: - Belts: Width (max) Length (avg) Height (avg) Main: 10,6" / 270 mm 249,34 ft / 76,00 m 8,20 ft / 2,50 m Ends: 1,77" / 45 mm 111,55 ft / 34,00 m 9,84 ft / 3,00 m 9,84 ft / 3,00 m Unarmoured ends Upper: 3,54" / 90 mm 262,47 ft / 80,00 m 6,56 ft / 2,00 m Main Belt covers 103% of normal length - Gun armour: Face (max) Other gunhouse (avg) Barbette/hoist (max) Main: 10,2" / 260 mm 5,12" / 130 mm 11,8" / 300 mm 2nd: 1,38" / 35 mm 0,35" / 9 mm - - Protected deck - single deck: For and Aft decks: 1,38" / 35 mm Forecastle: 0,98" / 25 mm Quarter deck: 1,18" / 30 mm - Conning towers: Forward 7,87" / 200 mm, Aft 0,98" / 25 mm Machinery: Coal and oil fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines, Direct drive, 2 shafts, 11 889 ihp / 8 869 Kw = 18,00 kts Range 1 600nm at 12,00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 634 tons (66% coal) Complement: 495 - 644 Cost: £1,024 million / $4,094 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 1 082 tons, 10,9% - Guns: 1 082 tons, 10,9% Armour: 2 878 tons, 29,1% - Belts: 1 324 tons, 13,4% - Armament: 965 tons, 9,8% - Armour Deck: 500 tons, 5,1% - Conning Towers: 88 tons, 0,9% Machinery: 1 885 tons, 19,1% Hull, fittings & equipment: 3 158 tons, 31,9% Fuel, ammunition & stores: 881 tons, 8,9% Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0,0% Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 9 902 lbs / 4 491 Kg = 11,4 x 12,0 " / 305 mm shells or 1,5 torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,30 Metacentric height 4,6 ft / 1,4 m Roll period: 13,5 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 70 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,64 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 1,39 Hull form characteristics: Hull has a flush deck, an extended bulbous bow and a round stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,688 / 0,690 Length to Beam Ratio: 5,38 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 19,25 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 51 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 50 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 19,00 degrees Stern overhang: 8,20 ft / 2,50 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 20,00%, 19,69 ft / 6,00 m, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m - Forward deck: 30,00%, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m - Aft deck: 35,00%, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m - Quarter deck: 15,00%, 14,76 ft / 4,50 m, 16,40 ft / 5,00 m - Average freeboard: 15,28 ft / 4,66 m Ship tends to be wet forward Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 103,0% - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 115,1% Waterplane Area: 20 254 Square feet or 1 882 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 91% Structure weight / hull surface area: 135 lbs/sq ft or 659 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 0,92 - Longitudinal: 2,18 - Overall: 1,00 Adequate machinery, storage, compartmentation space Adequate accommodation and workspace room Ship has slow, easy roll, a good, steady gun platform Good seaboat, rides out heavy weather easily

.

 Отправлено: 09.02.23 17:38. Заголовок: 2-3 тысячи тонн для ..

2-3 тысячи тонн для боевого корабля - самый неудачный формат.
Классический пример "Алмаз" куда влезло всё кроме собственно боевого корабля.
В 6000 тонн броненосный крейсер не влезет. Влезет в 8500 в и больше.
Крейсер с 4-мя 12 дюмовками начнется от 15 тысяч тонн. Если мы говорим именно про крейсер а не про легкий броненосец.
4000 тонн с двухорудийными башнями - интересная идея. Только скорость будет узлов 18

 Отправлено: 09.02.23 18:46. Заголовок: Пан директор пишет: ..

Пан директор пишет:

цитата:

Крейсер с 4-мя 12 дюймовками начнется от 15 тысяч тонн. Если мы говорим именно про крейсер а не про легкий броненосец.

Как бы не все 17-18 тысяч вышло - 15 тысяч было у Рюрика-2, с 4х10" и 8х8". Да и броневой пояс хотелось бы помощнее, чем "рюриковский" (от 6" в цитадели до 3" в оконечностях). Так что, ограничимся броненосными крейсерами двух типов:
1. "тяжелые". 11500 тонн, 4х2 - 8"/45 (ромбом) и 8х1 - 6"/45 в казематах (типа "Адмирал Нахимов", получше бронированный и с более мощными машинами)
2. "легкие" 8500 тонн, 2х1 - 8"/45 , 8х1 - 6"/45 (тот же "Баян" с может быть немного более мощными машинами)

Ну а больших (6-7 тысяч тонн) бронепалубников (типа "Дианы" или "Варяга") лучше вообще не строить - для эскадренной разведки и защиты от вражеских миноносцев нет ничего лучше, чем слегка "раздутый" (около 4000 тонн) "Новик" с 8х1 - 120/45 Канэ и полным ходом в 25-26 узлов при ограниченной дальности плавания

 Отправлено: 09.02.23 22:53. Заголовок: Инженер Сидоров пише..

Инженер Сидоров пишет:

цитата:

Как бы не все 17-18 тысяч вышло - 15 тысяч было у Рюрика-2, с 4х10" и 8х8".

Линейный крейсер Инвинсибл - 17 250 длинных тонн
Von der Tann - 19 370 метрических тонн
Цукуба - 13 750 длинных тонн
Ибуки - 14 636 длинных тонн
Рюрик 2 - 15 190 длинных тонн
Blücher - 15 842 тонн
Минотавр - 14 600 длинных тонн

Хорошо видно что в 15000 нормальный скоростной боевой корабль не влазил.

 Отправлено: 09.02.23 23:05. Заголовок: Инженер Сидоров пише..

Инженер Сидоров пишет:

цитата:

Ну а больших (6-7 тысяч тонн) бронепалубников (типа "Дианы" или "Варяга") лучше вообще не строить - для эскадренной разведки и защиты от вражеских миноносцев нет ничего лучше, чем слегка "раздутый" (около 4000 тонн) "Новик" с 8х1 - 120/45 Канэ и полным ходом в 25-26 узлов при ограниченной дальности плавания

Можно поступить проще - взять Аскольд у которого было 9 котлов и 3 паровые машины при мощности 19500 л.с. и умножить силовую на 2/3.

Получим 6 котлов, 2 паровые машины и 13000 л.с. Что для корабля в 4000 тонн даст скорость в районе 22-23 узлов.
Главное вооружение тоже можно уменьшить до 8 135-152-мм орудий. И получиться корабль по цене 60-70% от 6000 тонных разведчиков. Т.е. вместо двух крейсеров можно построить три.
Боевая эффективность - одинаковая.

 Отправлено: 10.02.23 10:12. Заголовок: Пан директор пишет: ..

Пан директор пишет:

цитата:

2 паровые машины и 13000 л.с. Что для корабля в 4000 тонн даст скорость в районе 22-23 узлов.

Примерно "Гамидие"/"Меджидие"/"Либия".

 Отправлено: 10.02.23 17:11. Заголовок: Пан директор пишет: ..

Пан директор пишет:

цитата:

Можно поступить проще - взять Аскольд у которого было 9 котлов и 3 паровые машины при мощности 19500 л.с. и умножить силовую на 2/3. Получим 6 котлов, 2 паровые машины и 13000 л.с. Что для корабля в 4000 тонн даст скорость в районе 22-23 узлов. Главное вооружение тоже можно уменьшить до 8 135-152-мм орудий. И получиться корабль по цене 60-70% от 6000 тонных разведчиков. Т.е. вместо двух крейсеров можно построить три. Боевая эффективность - одинаковая.

Ну да, примерно так - Аскольд из больших бронепалубников был, пожалуй, наиболее скоростным.

 Отправлено: 12.02.23 11:21. Заголовок: Пан директор пишет: ..

Пан директор пишет:

цитата:

2-3 тысячи тонн для боевого корабля - самый неудачный формат. Классический пример "Алмаз" куда влезло всё кроме собственно боевого корабля.

Если смотреть с "классической" точки зрения (мэхэнианство ) : дальняя разведка, рейдерство, мореходность, скорость, защита и вооружение.
При подходе к формированию структуры флота для действий в относительно ограниченном регионе-акватории (NB! не смешивать функциями кораблей-отрядов береговой обороны) появляются иные взгляды и возможности.
Крейсерство в океанах и дальние переходы обеспечиваются дополнительными мероприятиями.

аи-версия витте-Циклона:
laid down 1901, Displacement: 168 t light; 173 t standard; 180 t normal; 186 t full load

Скрытый текст

Dimensions: Length (overall / waterline) x beam x draught (normal/deep) (178,52 ft / 170,60 ft) x 16,40 ft x (4,92 / 5,03 ft) (54,41 m / 52,00 m) x 5,00 m x (1,50 / 1,53 m) Armament: 1 - 2,99" / 76,0 mm 45,0 cal gun - 13,51lbs / 6,13kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing gun in deck mount, 1901 Model 1 x Single mount on centreline, aft deck aft 3 - 1,85" / 47,0 mm 45,0 cal guns - 3,19lbs / 1,45kg shells, 150 per gun Quick firing guns in deck mounts, 1901 Model 1 x Single mount on centreline, forward deck forward 2 x Single mounts on sides, forward deck aft Weight of broadside 23 lbs / 10 kg Main Torpedoes 4 - 15,0" / 380 mm, 16,40 ft / 5,00 m torpedoes - 0,441 t each, 1,764 t total In 2 sets of deck mounted centre rotating tubes 2nd Torpedoes 2 - 15,0" / 380 mm, 16,40 ft / 5,00 m torpedoes - 0,441 t each, 0,882 t total In 2 sets of deck mounted carriage/fixed tubes Armour: - Conning towers: Forward 0,35" / 9 mm, Aft 0,00" / 0 mm Machinery: Coal fired boilers, complex reciprocating steam engines, Direct drive, 2 shafts, 3 712 ihp / 2 769 Kw = 24,00 kts Range 400nm at 11,00 kts Bunker at max displacement = 12 tons (100% coal) Caution: Delicate, lightweight machinery Complement: 23 - 31 Cost: £0,023 million / $0,091 million Distribution of weights at normal displacement: Armament: 9 tons, 5,2% - Guns: 5 tons, 2,6% - Weapons: 5 tons, 2,6% Armour: 0 tons, 0,1% - Conning Tower: 0 tons, 0,1% Machinery: 111 tons, 61,8% Hull, fittings & equipment: 47 tons, 25,9% Fuel, ammunition & stores: 12 tons, 6,9% Miscellaneous weights: 0 tons, 0,0% Overall survivability and seakeeping ability: Survivability (Non-critical penetrating hits needed to sink ship): 42 lbs / 19 Kg = 3,1 x 3,0 " / 76 mm shells or 0,3 torpedoes Stability (Unstable if below 1.00): 1,43 Metacentric height 0,6 ft / 0,2 m Roll period: 8,8 seconds Steadiness - As gun platform (Average = 50 %): 45 % - Recoil effect (Restricted arc if above 1.00): 0,13 Seaboat quality (Average = 1.00): 0,76 Hull form characteristics: Hull has rise forward of midbreak, a normal bow and a round stern Block coefficient (normal/deep): 0,458 / 0,462 Length to Beam Ratio: 10,40 : 1 'Natural speed' for length: 13,06 kts Power going to wave formation at top speed: 68 % Trim (Max stability = 0, Max steadiness = 100): 53 Bow angle (Positive = bow angles forward): 22,00 degrees Stern overhang: 3,28 ft / 1,00 m Freeboard (% = length of deck as a percentage of waterline length): Fore end, Aft end - Forecastle: 18,00%, 11,48 ft / 3,50 m, 8,20 ft / 2,50 m - Forward deck: 30,00%, 8,20 ft / 2,50 m, 8,20 ft / 2,50 m - Aft deck: 39,00%, 5,58 ft / 1,70 m, 5,58 ft / 1,70 m - Quarter deck: 13,00%, 5,58 ft / 1,70 m, 6,56 ft / 2,00 m - Average freeboard: 7,14 ft / 2,18 m Ship tends to be wet forward Ship space, strength and comments: Space - Hull below water (magazines/engines, low = better): 206,1% - Above water (accommodation/working, high = better): 67,3% Waterplane Area: 1 797 Square feet or 167 Square metres Displacement factor (Displacement / loading): 16% Structure weight / hull surface area: 15 lbs/sq ft or 71 Kg/sq metre Hull strength (Relative): - Cross-sectional: 0,50 - Longitudinal: 1,62 - Overall: 0,56 Extremely poor machinery, storage, compartmentation space Cramped accommodation and workspace room Poor seaboat, wet and uncomfortable, reduced performance in heavy weather

И ещё предложение - перестройка "Адм. Корнилова" в авиатранспорт, около 1908-1911 г, м.б с заменой котлов и машин на турбины (экспериментальные)

 Отправлено: 13.02.23 18:58. Заголовок: von Echenbach пишет:..

von Echenbach пишет:

цитата:

И ещё предложение - перестройка "Адм. Корнилова" в авиатранспорт, около 1908-1911 г, м.б с заменой котлов и машин на турбины (экспериментальные)

А стоит ли это старьё вообще во что-то перестраивать, тем более, столь радикальным образом? Не дешевле выйдет просто утилизировать? Не зря же его в 1911 году исключили из состава флота "за непригодностью к дальнейшей службе"

 Отправлено: 14.02.23 07:53. Заголовок: Инженер Сидоров пише..

Инженер Сидоров пишет:

цитата:

А стоит ли это старьё вообще во что-то перестраивать, тем более, столь радикальным образом? Не дешевле выйдет просто утилизировать?

Корпус уже есть, с +- котлами и винтами-валами. Новый строить под "неизведанное"? Также и новый транспорт-пароход не отдадут. Из "+" - отработка технологии базирования, проектирования.
Почти "ремонт" броненосцев Австрии, в своё время. Балтика и м.б. показательные плавания в Архангельск-Мурманск

 Отправлено: 14.02.23 20:36. Заголовок: von Echenbach пишет:..

von Echenbach пишет:

цитата:

Корпус уже есть

Прежде чем что-то проектировать на основе имеющегося железа, надо вначале оценить степень годности имеющегося железа. Хотя сама идея вполне себе здравая, но вот выбор основы... Не зря же сие корыто было утилизировано в 1911 году "за полной негодностью к службе" - и, скорее всего, проблема была именно в износе корпусных конструкций. Как известно, некоторые корабли намного более ранней постройки ("Генерал-Адмирал"/"Нарова", "Герцог Эдинбургский"/"Онега", "Минин"/"Ладога") не только были сохранены в составе флота, но и переоборудованы в минные заградители, причем, первые два - дожили до конца Великой Отечественной. К чему это я? Да к тому, что могут найтись и другие кандидаты на переоборудование в гидроавиатранспорт. Ну а если уж так хочется сохранить "Корнилова", то можно его переоборудовать в заградитель.